As my senior year is fast approaching, I have been thinking a lot about my overall college experience, graduation, and trying to find my first full-time job. In an effort to talk these thoughts through, I had a conversation with my recently graduated friend, Anne, about her experience with the job search and not having a job straight out of college.

*Spoiler Alert* She’s still looking for a job. And that’s ok! We should be able to talk about things that are tough or uncomfortable without always feeling the need to put that asterisk on it mentioning that everything worked out in the end and is fine and dandy. And I really feel like that’s what this whole conversation was about. And I really appreciate Anne for being incredibly honest about those mixed emotions.

You can listen to and read a transcript of our full conversation below.

But, if you’re short for time, I wanted to give a few highlights.

You Never Know How Much You Have in Common with Someone Until You Ask

I knew I loved Anne and that she was a great person, but I never knew how many shared experiences and feelings we had until we started to talk about these things.

We both played field hockey in high school and had an unfair experience with a coach senior year. We both struggled during our first two years at Georgetown with fitting in and making strong connections. We both seemed to share an ambivalence towards the institution of Georgetown and towards how we interacted with it, at times blaming ourselves for our bad experiences.

I feel like a lot of people could relate to the emotions we relay in this conversation, while at the same time originally thinking they were alone.

Picking a School is Hard

We both also lamented our choice in choosing to come to Georgetown in a way. We shared the sentiment that it’s really hard to make such an impactful decision at such a young age. Especially when other people are swayed by the “big name” of Georgetown and encourage you in a particular direction.

One thing that does ease this regret, however, is finding other people who can share in and not belittle those feelings. Just being able to talk honestly about not loving the college I chose but at the same time trying to make the best out of the situation I’m in was freeing.

The Job Search is Not Fair

Everyone knows that it’s all about who you know when trying to find a job. Even if you don’t want to admit it to yourself.

But Anne gives some really practical advice about reaching out to strangers in your broader network through LinkedIn. It’s best to start early, before there’s any pressure or expectations, she says. Just find people at companies or in positions you may want to work in who also go to your school and take a stab in the dark. Shoot them a message or an email just to ask about what their job is like, what they do on a day to day basis, etc. You never know what could come out of it.

Finding a Mentor

One last piece of very practical advice that Anne shared is to take a professor you liked twice.

We both expressed our disappointment about not really forming strong relationships with professors or finding a mentor on campus. But, one thing that she said really helped her feel more comfortable going to office hours and engaging with a professor more outside of class was taking the same professor twice.

That’s something so simple almost anyone could do it so I wanted to highlight it here as well.

There are so many other little tidbits from our conversation, but you’ll just have to listen/read to get them all.

Kiren: Thanks for talking to me!

Anne: Yeah… you want to know what it’s like to not have a job? (Laughs) Do you have questions planned?

K: I do have questions planned. Do you still not have a job? Is this still relevant?

A: No, I don’t.

K: Perfect!

A: Great timing!

K: So, do you want to just start by walking me through your senior year?

A: Sure, wow it’s weird to be on the other side of things. But, you mean in what way?

K: However you want to sum it up, what it was like for you.

A: Hmm, yeah well I guess I had really high expectations and then—well which is always the first mistake—but yeah I had high expectations and was really excited to do FOCI [Anne was a FOCI leader] and I think there are just high expectations in general around senior year. Cause everyone’s like, Oh, it’s senior year! School doesn’t matter! and stuff like that. And then, I was kind of expecting my friends to be less busy than we all were, and we just didn’t get as much time to hang out as I would have liked. So, it ended up being just as much about internships and academics as every other year, I think. Which, I wish was not the case, but it kind of was. Yeah, and I also had a part-time job and a part-time internship on top of a full course load in the fall semester, so I was just super swamped. But, being part-time is great! Which is what I was second semester so I would recommend that.

K: Yeah, that sounds nice.

A: Because you can actually dedicate all the time you want to your classes, which you can’t really do with five.

K: Yeah. Do you think there’s a way around being so busy? Or a way of finding time to hang out with friends? Maybe if you had scheduled it better or planned it out? Or were you guys just thinking, It’s going to be this way, but then you didn’t make the time? I don’t know.

A: Yeah, hmm. I do think planning out time helps because it’s a lot harder to back out of a commitment than to say “Oh, sorry, I can’t right now. I’m busy.” Like if someone invites you to do something spontaneously.

K: Yeah.

A: I don’t know, for me at least. But, it was also on me. Like, I get stressed about school and spend way too much time doing assignments that don’t matter. So, I don’t know. Yeah, it’s hard. I do think planning helps. There’s also just, it’s Georgetown so everyone’s busy, generally. I don’t know, in your experience what has helped?

K: I don’t know. I’m also trying to figure out how to plan things with friends and make sure I do things. I feel like, just for me, if people say they’re busy, I try to make a plan with myself. Like, I’m going to do something every weekend and I’ll invite my friends along. But, if they say no, I’m like, Ok, whatever, I’m still going to you know, go to Southeast or go to the mall or go to this restaurant. And just do things.

A: Yeah, it definitely does help I think saying, instead of trying to coordinate everyone, saying “I’m going to go do this thing and if anyone wants to come along.” And if your group of three friends can’t, usually at least one person can.

K: What about, your Georgetown or college experience? Is there a way you’d sum that up?

A: (Laughs) That’s a loaded question!

K: Yeah, well I saw your graduation post online and I really appreciated it. Because I feel like everyone’s always like, “College was amazing!” “Best four years!” “I made amazing friends!” And you were kind of just like, “It was good, it was bad, it was college and I’m done.”

A: Yeah, that’s why I did that because I just kept seeing—even with people that I knew had a hard time in college—kind of sugar-coating it or just doing the thing where they tie a bow on it and I don’t know, it was important for me to recognize and write down somewhere that it was hard a lot of the time. And the first two years were horrible, kind of. And yeah.

K: Yeah, why do you think that is? What made the first two years so bad?

A: Umm, I think I just was going through a lot personally, was very anxious about school and other stuff. And I don’t know. I think I also just didn’t have a great attitude. And was anxious about meeting people. And I think anxiety prevented me from joining new clubs and I didn’t really join anything until I started doing the voice sophomore year. And, I wish I had done a sport, I didn’t do a sport. There are so many things I wish I just threw myself into and didn’t really care about what happened or what the outcome was but just kind of did it for the fun of it. But, I don’t know. I think I also was kind of sick of the things I did in high school like the sports I did or playing music in band. But then I realized that I really missed it and didn’t have a way to do those things. If that makes sense.

K: What sports did you play in high school?

A: I played field hockey for four years.

K: No way! Me too! Wait did we ever talk about this?

A: I think we’ve talked about this. I kind of forgot, but yeah.

K: Yeah I forgot that you played. What position did you play?

A: I was a half-back and a middy [mid-fielder]. What about you?

K: I played, like, all the positions (laughs). Cause I’m from a small school, so my freshman year I was on defense. And then my sophomore year I was a mid-fielder. And then my junior year, they put me on offense. And then my senior year I was back on defense, so yeah.

A: Yeah, I miss it. It’s fun.

K: Yeah.

A: Why didn’t you do it? Did you not want to do it at Georgetown either?

K: Well, my senior year, my coach had a grudge against me or something. Basically, we got a new coach in the middle of the summer and she moved up our preseason. So, I already had plans during when she made the preseason so I was late to preseason and I was kind of out of shape at the beginning of preseason. So, she thought I was just a bad player and then she didn’t really play me the whole season.

A: Mmm

K: Even though, I had been playing varsity since like my sophomore year. And, I don’t think I was an amazing player but I really loved field hockey and I was ok. And then it was my senior year and she never played me and I was kind of like, I’m over this, sports are dumb, coaches are rude.

A: Yeah, that’s exactly how I felt. It was so weird, cause it was basically the same scenario. But, I was a captain and I played the first half—like I had started every game in the first half of the season. And then all of a sudden, my coach just stopped playing me. I was barely playing in games. I wouldn’t start anymore. And it was so random and she never really explained what had happened. And I was like, Oh do you think my playing’s gone down hill? I don’t know. I feel like coaches just are so manipulative sometimes and kind of mess with your head. And it just ruined the sport for me.

K: Yeah, my coach, she put a freshman in my spot and played her like 90% of the games, would put me in for like 5 minutes. And I even talked to her about it and was like, Why are you doing this? I’m a senior, I should at least get playing time because of that, because it’s my last year. And she just gave me some excuse. So, I was just like, This is dumb.

A: Yeah.

K: And I even signed up for the club team at Georgetown. Yeah, I got on their mailing list, but I was too afraid to actually go to the practices.

A: Same!

K: I was like, I’m not good enough anymore.

A: Yeah, I went second semester freshman year. But I couldn’t find them. They were practicing inside so I couldn’t find them in Yates. And I don’t know. Then at the time I just got nervous and left and never found them and then never went back.

K: Aww

A: It was so weird. Like, I wish I just did it.

K: Maybe I’ll do it next year, I don’t know.

A: You should do it! I heard they have a bunch of people who’ve never played before so it’s pretty low-key.

K: Yeah, maybe I will. I don’t know, do you feel like there’s a way to get around that feeling? Because I feel like a lot of times I have that same thing where I expect bad things to happen and then bad things happen because I expect it to be bad and then I don’t put in the effort. And then I blame myself after the fact because I say to myself, if I was just more positive it would have been better. But then, blaming myself just makes me feel worse.

A: Yeah, I feel like it really is just like a head-space. And I think it’s just becoming aware of the thought process that’s going on in your head and how you can shut it off and what’s irrational about it. Like, I’ve written down specific phrases and things that help you snap out of it. I can’t remember them now, but I can send them to you if you want.

K: Yeah, that would be cool.

A: But yeah, you have to recognize it in the moment which is hard when you’re kind of spiraling.

K: Yeah, sometimes I’m just like, “F- you! Shut up. I’m doing this anyway.” I don’t know.

A: Yeah! You can definitely—like, I rationalize myself out of it sometimes like, “I have done so many things like this before.” And I also think like going abroad was really helpful for me because you have to get over a fear of talking to strangers or a fear of messing up and looking ridiculous. Because, when you’re learning a new language, you’re going to look ridiculous all the time. And then I think it made things here just a lot easier, because I was like, Whatever, I don’t care. I’ve looked ridiculous before.

K: Yeah, that’s good.

So, how did you pick your major? Did you always know you were going to do English or was it a last-minute decision?

A: (Laughs) So yeah, I went into college, I think I was undeclared—I don’t remember if I was undeclared or English—but I was in the College. And I kind of thought I wanted to do English and if I hadn’t declared for Georgetown, I definitely declared for some of the other schools that I applied to. But, was kind of like, I’ll feel around and see if something else is more interesting to me. And then there was a point freshman year—I actually think a lot of freshmen have this—where I was like, I’m not doing enough. I should be in the SFS and studying international politics and speaking three languages! And I had that feeling that I wasn’t doing enough. And I think I took econ and was like, I actually hate this, like, get me out. I miss English. And then eventually the more I thought about it, I was like, well, my English classes are the ones I like the most. And I don’t know what I want to do so might as well do something I enjoy.

K: So, you didn’t know what you wanted to do, how did you decide… Well are you decided on journalism? Is that the jobs that you’re looking at now?

A: Uh, yeah. Journalism and I guess some publishing, editing and that kind of stuff. Some communications, I’m kind of over comm but Still looking just in case.

K: Mhm

A: Yeah, I guess I’ve always written, and kept journals and that sort of stuff, like short stories early on when I was growing up. But that sort of thing seemed so abstract and useless when you’re thinking about jobs. But then I started writing for The Voice and was like, Oh, I actually can write about things and meet deadlines. You know? Cause something like that was really scary for me at first. But yeah, then I got clips from that and then applied for the journalism minor because I was like this seems like a good application of—Well cause I think the appeal of journalism for a lot of people is that they like writing and reading and this is a more practical application that has job opportunities—although not a lot (laughs) I realize. Which, you know, writing your novella doesn’t. So, I guess it was that. It felt practical and I also enjoyed it so, yeah. Does that make sense?

K: Yeah! And so, I guess what has the job search actually been like then?

A: The job search? It sucks. Oh man, it’s like looking for an internship but 10,000 times worse. So, it’s annoying how much it’s about connections and networking. Like, people had always told me that, but I guess I didn’t want to believe that was true cause it’s annoying to think that you could have solid experience and write a good cover letter and then, just not get noticed when you put in an application to a black hole of an online portal with like 500 other applicants. So, it definitely is about who you know unless you’re applying to somewhere really small that’s not getting a lot of applicants. Yeah, but even if you don’t know people, cause I don’t really know people in journalism and all of my friends don’t necessarily know people in their field but you can like go on LinkedIn and see the connections at your school that are working at a certain place and just like email them. And I think it works. It’s more successful to do it before there’s like a specific job posting you’re looking for and just be like, “Hey! I’m really interested in your company, can I learn about what you do every day?” Or some variation of that. And most of the time no one answers but sometimes they do. Like one time, one woman answered and was super nice and talked to me on the phone and then we scheduled a date to get coffee at the end of May. And then before that happened, she just emailed me like, “Hey, this job opportunity opened up, do you want to apply for it?” And I applied and I was so mad that it didn’t work out because they needed me to interview in person the week of graduation.

K: Oh man!

A: Yeah, but that was definitely the closest I’ve gotten to something working out, meanwhile having applied to probably 15 other things where I just haven’t heard back or have gotten mass responses back of “You have not been selected for this” basically. And you’re just rarely put in contact with a real person. So, I think if you can leverage an internship into a job, that kind of spares you from this whole agonizing process. But that kind of sums it up I guess.

K: So, have you been doing more of that then? Like reaching out to random people?

A: I guess, yes and no. To some extent it feels weird at this point in the game, because it feels like I’m asking for too much. Maybe that’s just me being dumb about it but I don’t know. Cause it feels weird to find someone from, I don’t know, just for example, say from NPR. And I see someone from my school who works at NPR to be like, “Hey, can you flag my application or reach out to someone?” I don’t know, like I’m trying to but a lot of times the available positions are at companies where no one from Georgetown is and it’s like a shot in the dark to email someone. But, it really depends I guess on the situation. How have you found looking for internships and stuff? Have you found it difficult?

K: Yeah, I feel like it’s the same thing that you’re describing. And like you said the only time that I had some success in finding an internship that I’m actually excited about and really like is when I went to this linguistics career fair thing and they gave a bunch of people’s emails. And there was one company that I thought was really cool and I only talked to the woman who represented them for like 5 minutes, I just like, introduced myself. But, I got her email and I was looking at their website and I was like, their website’s kind of bad, they could use help with this. They didn’t really have any blog posts. I looked at their Twitter, their LinkedIn, they had an Instagram. And I was like they could use help with this, it’s just not very great right now. So, I reached out her. And I don’t really have that much experience with that kind of thing. I have some through clubs that I’ve managed and stuff. But I was like, “I think you could use help with this if you want to hear what I have to say.”

A: Yeah, that’s a great idea.

K: Yeah, so she emailed me back and she was like, “Sure! I’d love to talk to you.” And she asked if I’d like to write blog posts for them.

A: Oh, that’s awesome.

K: And I was like, Oh, I’m going to get this internship! But then, she asked how much I would want to be paid. And I was like, I have no idea how much a person should be paid for writing a blog post. And I think by the time I responded to her, I think I put my price-point too high for a college kid who has no experience and she was like, “We hired somebody else, thank you though.”

A: What? That’s so annoying. For a position you like made for yourself?

K: Yeah well, she said that they were looking into people to get their blog running and they had contacted people who are into like search engine optimization marketing who told them that they needed to do their blog more. Um, but I would recommend that. If there’s a company that you see and there’s something lacking that you think you could help with and just being like, “I don’t know you, but you could use help with this.”

A: Yeah, I mean that definitely works for a small freelancing gig. Yeah, it’s just a matter of having a steady income, I guess.

K: (Laughs) Yeah, a real job. Did you start your job search during senior year? Or were you just like, It’ll work out in the end?

A: So, the jobs I was applying to and especially journalism, there’s such quick turnover unless it’s a fellowship or like a year-long internship, that you don’t really apply until like two weeks before graduation. That’s like the earliest people told us to. There were some, I did apply to some fellowships and never heard back. I guess I did a little bit of that in March and tried to reach out to people and network in March. And then, I did some applying in April too and then have mostly have really gotten into it since graduating.

K: That’s kind of scary.

A: (Sighs) Yeah, it is. But yeah, I’m also just very lucky that I can go home and do this from home and not have to worry about having to find a job before I graduate like some of my friends.

K: Do you feel like you had any academic advisors or professors that gave you guidance while you were at Georgetown?

A: In the job search or just in general?

K: I guess in the job search but also in general.

A: Hmm… (long pause). Honestly, not really. I think for the journalism advisors, one complaint that some of my friends had about the program was that they didn’t do enough of that in a very competitive industry. And, I’m sure if I had asked more of my professors or brought it up with more of them, they would have been happy to offer me advise. But never unsolicited did they say like, “Oh, if you ever want to talk about jobs, come talk to me.” I did actually have my English capstone professor; he was the only person that I ever had that like just out of nowhere was like, “Hey, if you ever need a letter of recommendation just let me know.” Which was amazing. And I haven’t had to take him up on it yet. But, I feel like that’s so awkward for so many people, just asking that. And to have someone offer that without having to ask and have that awkward conversation was great. But, otherwise not really. I mean, I guess in my on-campus job I worked with someone who had graduated a few years before me and he was like the closest thing I had to like any type of mentor I had at Georgetown. Which is kind of sad.

K: So you didn’t really have a close relationship with any of your professors?

A: I mean, not someone I would feel comfortable like just to have a conversation with. Like, I feel like I would need a reason to go talk to them. You know, I’ve never just like dropped in and been like, Hey! I don’t know, I guess some of the journalism professors to an extent but not really. What about you?

K: No! Like, I feel like that’s just a problem with myself. Is that, I feel like I have to have a reason to go, or I have to have a question, or I have to be struggling with something. And it’s like, in a lot of my classes I didn’t really have questions or a struggle. Or, I would only go if I needed help before a test or I didn’t grasp a certain concept.

A: Yeah, exactly.

K: And then I’d be like, “Ok, thank you, bye!” But one thing I’m really going to try to do next semester, hopefully. Well, I’m telling myself I’m going to do this. Is just go to all of my professors’ office hours at least once. Like, in the beginning of the semester so it’s like there’s no reason I would be here except to say hi and I’m in your class and I wanted to meet you.

A: Yeah, I tried to do the same thing and I think every semester I had that intention. But then, when you don’t really have a reason I always ended up talking myself out of it. But I think what really helped me in that regard cause I think it’s a really common thing to not have a close—cause I’ve had this conversation with so many people where it’s like everyone’s just like, I really never got a good mentor and I wish I did. So, I think it’s more common than that one person who that professor knows by name in a 200 person class makes you think it is. But if you can take a professor twice, that helps so much. I did that in one of my English classes and it was just so nice. Because, I felt comfortable going to the office hours already and the professor knew my name and I wish I took more professors twice. I think that’s how you get to know people too.

K: Yeah, that’s good advice.

A: Even though some people are like, I’ve had them, I want a new person. But if there’s a professor you like, I would definitely recommend taking one of their classes as an elective or something.

K: Did you ever go to the career center?

A: Oh. Man. (Laughs) Yeah, yeah. Not very helpful.

K: Yeah…

A: Right? I feel like everyone can pretty much agree on that.

K: Yeah. But, what was your personal experience? Like, did you go there for a specific reason?

A: My personal experience? I went like sophomore year for someone to read over my cover letter and resume. And maybe I went twice. Because, the first time it was another student. So I got no feedback whatsoever. Then, I was like, Well, that wasn’t helpful. And then I actually got one of the employees to read it over and that was helpful on my resume. No one ever helped with cover letters ever. But, I at least got feedback on my resume. And then I did a career exploration thing freshman year to like figure our where my interests lie, and that was kind of cool! I would recommend that! It’s like a very casual conversation, and I think his name’s Julio, the advisor that manages that. And he’s very nice. And there’s like these exercises to help you think about types of work and work environments that you might be more inclined towards. And then I did industry advising and that was not helpful (laughs). I went a few times and she just gave me databases of where to find internships and I was like, No, like I can find the internship listings, I just can’t get a foot in the door. Like, that’s the problem. And to that extent, that’s what was frustrating. When you actually know what you want to do and you know how to write a cover letter and resume and just can’t land anything.

K: Yeah, especially with Georgetown where I feel like people think the “alumni network” and all of the connections are so great.

A: Right.

K: And then they’re not actually good at helping you with career advice.

A: Yup. Yeah, a hundred percent. Or people just like don’t answer you or people are not as willing to help or don’t have the time that you think they do. But, I would recommend going to employer panels because you can definitely get business cards and reach out to people through that. And I know one of my friends, there was a journalism career panel and she got an internship through that. Just cause, she’s very likeable and talkative and can like hold a conversation with anyone and got opportunities just by talking to someone. So, I guess that helps too. But, as far as the industry advising goes, I don’t know.

K: Yeah.

A: Cause there’s no feeders for liberal arts like there are for say, consulting. There’s no recruiting so…

K: Yeah, everyone’s just kind of on their own.

A: Yeah, which stinks but—

K: Have we ever talked about why you chose Georgetown? Like why you decided to come here?

A: Umm yeah, it wasn’t my first choice. Like, I knew I wanted to be in a city and like Brown was my first choice and I didn’t get in. And then I was deciding between NYU and Georgetown. And I wanted to go to NYU but it was so expensive so I’m kind of glad I didn’t go there. But, everyone—well, when you say the name of a good school, everyone just reacts in a way that makes you feel like you would be stupid to not choose that. And I also had a full ride to North Eastern and turned that down to go to Georgetown, God knows why.

K: Oh my God, my brother went to North Eastern! Did you know that?

A: Really? What’d he study? I didn’t know that!

K: Yeah! He studied business, supply chain management. He works at Wayfair now.

A: Did he like the co-op thing?

K: Yeah, he really liked it. He liked North Eastern just in general.

A: A girl that, she went to Georgetown freshman year and then she transferred to North Eastern but then she was back for her co-op in DC, she lived with us last year, she liked it too, I think. Yeah, so I just feel like I didn’t have—like my guidance counselors were not involved in helping us apply for college. So, I think I just got a lot of bad guidance and made the decision that I thought people wanted me to make.

K: Yeah.

A: But, I’m obviously very grateful for the education that I had and I think it was a wonderful education. But, I don’t know. Yeah, I think that’s why the first couple years were hard too. Because my heart wasn’t really in it.

K: Yeah.

A: Why’d you pick Georgetown?

K: Um, I mean it’s sort of a similar thing. Like, I was between Middlebury and Georgetown. And my parents were really more excited about Georgetown because it’s—I guess a bigger name. But Middlebury is also like a great school, especially for languages.

A: Yeah! Especially for languages!

K: Yeah, cause I wanted to study languages, linguistics and stuff. And I told myself—cause I took that gap year and I applied for the State Department scholarship to study Russian. And I told myself, If I don’t get it, I’ll go to Georgetown, because then I’ll have more options and maybe I won’t study languages and linguistics. But, if I do get it, then I’ll go to Middlebury because it’ll make more sense. I’ll study Russian for a year, then I’ll come back and I’ll study Russian at Middlebury. But anyway, so I got the scholarship so I was like, Ok, I’ll go to Middlebury then. But I was still kind of torn. And I visited both schools and I liked Georgetown better, location-wise. And, I don’t know. I talked to my guidance counselor, I made a pro-con list. And I just decided on Georgetown. But I don’t know.

A: Yeah, it’s weird how a decision you make that young can have so much bearing on four years of your life.

K: Yeah. But, who knows, I could have hated it at Middlebury, you never know.

A: Right, exactly, you never know. No “regrats”.

(Both laugh)

K: But in that sense, what advice would you give to other people? Like, you said you got bad advice along the way.

A: Like trying to pick a school?

K: Yeah, and trying to look for jobs, trying to be a successful student at Georgetown once you’ve picked it.

A: Hmm, I think that for the first part, picking a school is so hard. You don’t know what you want to do, you have no experience. I kind of wish I did a gap year. I would probably give that advice, like travel for a year. Like, you did a gap year, right?

K: Yeah.

A: Would you advise people to do that?

K: I would advise people to do it just because, when else are you going to have the freedom to just travel for a year, or study something for a year, or work for a year with no real pressure? Like after college there’s pressure to get a job, after that there’s pressure to support yourself and pay your bills. But in terms of figuring out what I really wanted to do in life, I don’t think it really helped me. But it helped me, I think, gain more confidence in myself like you were talking about with studying abroad. I made a lot of close friends and it changed my perspective on the world. So, I would advise it for those reasons.

A: Yeah, I agree. I think that just the general confidence helps a lot especially before you go into the workplace. But choosing colleges is hard. Like, I know friends who thought they wanted to do this very specific science course and are now realizing that’s not what they want to do but have a year or two left and can’t really back-track. So, I just think it’s just hard to make a decision that will affect the rest of your life when you’re 18. But, as far as job-search, I think, go to all the career panels and get as many business cards as you can. And I guess, it depends on the field, but for journalism it’s so hard because to get the paid opportunities you have to do a lot of unpaid work. So, I think if you can do the unpaid work while still having a part-time job, that might help. But otherwise, the other advice I would give is take a professor twice or more than twice. And I guess, like make friends. Because that helps too. If you have friends that have parents who have connections or something. You know there are people who are like, I don’t have time for this club because I have to get an internship. But I think having a bigger social circle, as horrible as that sounds, probably helps more in the long run. So, I hope that helps to some degree.

K: I feel like there’s also a correlation factor where people who are more outgoing and good at networking and more social have a bigger social circle.

A: Yeah, exactly. I don’t know, advice is so hard. I don’t feel qualified to give advice though.

K: Anything else you just want to talk about or complain about?

A: Complain about? (Laughs) Hmm, I think the general pre-professional attitude at Georgetown sucks and needs to go away. Like no one needs that. It’s college. You should be able to do things with no pressure and, I don’t know, have fun! And there’s no like, the weird culture—you know what I mean?—there’s no weird culture at Georgetown and the one that is there is very tiny.

(Both laugh)

K: How do you find it? Where are they?

A: I don’t know… Because when I went to Oberlin, the people there are so frickin’ weird. We need more of that in college. Like, I don’t know, people that just had weird interests and didn’t care that their interests were weird and just spent time exploring those interests instead of worrying about the job search. But then at the same time I’m like, “You should be networking!” I don’t know.

K: I agree.

A: Do you have any Georgetown complaints?

K: I don’t know, most of my complaints with Georgetown are like with the administration and the system, and I guess also the culture. But, I don’t know. And then there’s just stuff with myself that made it bad or good.

A: Exactly, and I try to remember that when I’m venting. Like, the first two years sucked because I was dealing with stuff myself so.

K: Yeah, but I don’t know. I feel that but at the same time, if I was at a different school, or it was a different culture, different environment, things might have been different. So, it’s weird to sort that out and be like, how much is me? How much is this place? And how much of this place do I not like because of myself and how much is it just not right for me.

A: Yeah, I feel that completely. But the second I could no longer transfer and was like a second semester junior or senior, I was like, “well, even if it is the place, it doesn’t really make a difference at this point so might as well have as good of an attitude as possible or as good as I can muster. Despite all the things that bother me about this place, you know?

K: Yeah.

Well, that’s all my questions.

A: Ok. I feel like this was a downer of a conversation.

K: But I mean, that’s the point! Everyone is always trying to be positive and I’m just like, not everything’s positive all the time. Sometimes things are just bad. Or sometimes it’s just mediocre. Why can’t we talk about that?

A: Ok, I just wanted to make sure you wanted that from me. Thank you for listening.

K: I mean, I’m not—If you are super positive, I don’t want to be disingenuous to that either. But if this is just where you’re at, I just want it to be an honest conversation.

A: Yeah, no, I appreciate it, it was nice talking to someone about the job search who has no stakes in me finding a job like my parents do.

K: Well, I’m excited to know what happens either way.

A: Thanks Kiren, I will let you know.